Messed!Up
Phoebe Hall and Jonny Hughes come together to discuss their new EP released 12th of April featuring the title track ‘Naked’, a song featuring emotional themes about her struggle with her sexuality and coming to terms with her body and mental health. Phoebe Hall also released the Better EP with its title track being one of my personal favourites. It’s impossible not to feel drawn in by the sense of yearning communicated by what is actually quite an upbeat song.
I met up with Phoebe and Jonny before their Manchester gig at Yes Bar. In this interview, we discussed themes and processes for writing as well as a look into the duo’s relationship and how the band’s sound has changed after introducing a live drummer.
Where things began
How long have you been gigging for?
“Since the end of 2021. Is that a long time? It feels like it hasn’t been that long.”
Well, that’s three years
“Oh god yeah, you’re right. That’s so weird.”
Time flies when you’re having fun I suppose. Did you start as a solo act?
“It was me and Jonny. We met each other at university and we started playing as a two-piece. It was a project I was driving but he joined me in creating it, and now we have just introduced a drummer to the mix.”
So it’s a full-on band now. How has that been?
“Well, we used to use tracks for drums. Now we have a real-life drummer which really helps bring more energy to the sets. It just takes the pressure off me. I have a lot of energy when I perform but it’s comforting knowing if I did deplete a bit in energy, I’ve got two performers to pick me back up.”
I spoke to Jonny briefly and it didn’t seem like he loved the limelight too much. Has a drummer helped him when performing too?
“You should see him on stage! He’s a different man.”
I’m sure I’ll eat my words. I can’t wait to see him transform!
“I think when you see us you will be shocked at the change in energy from all of us.” (laughs)
I am excited! Do you have alternative personas when you go on stage?
“No I don’t think so (laughs) but I would say my performance style is like an extra version of myself. The arrogant parts are displayed but in a nice way.”
So arrogant but in a charming and endearing way?
“I hope so.”
The need for more queer music: The songwriting process
Who would you say you make music for? Who do you play to in a room?
“For me, when I was growing up, I felt like I didn’t really relate to any pop music and I did that whole denying pop music when I was younger.”
Did you used to pretend to hate One Direction.
“I did yeah, but really I love One Direction. I secretly really liked pop music and when I started to write my own music I decided I really wanted to write some pop music. I found it hard because I had never heard people in pop talk about Queerness or not fitting in and the kind of things I speak about. I would say I play to the people in the room that were like me when I was younger. The queer misguided youth. It was just quite unusual at the time to hear a young pop singer talk about that kind of stuff.”
Writing for the young, queer audience?
“Exactly! We deserve it. It is a scene that has existed for a long time, and I was really eager to add to it.”
This is obviously something you are very passionate about which really reflects in your lyrics.
Phoebe: “I struggle to write music that doesn’t mean anything. I tend to go into writing by speaking about me and my experiences in the hope that there are people who might relate.”
Do you write your songs alone?
“It depends. I do sometimes, and when I do, I find that lyricism is what comes easiest to me. Even if I am in a slump with writing I can still write lyrics. My notes app is chaos! (laughs) There will be a few shopping lists and then the next few will be about how I felt unloved. When I am in a session I usually bring a theme or context to Jonny which we then work on by jamming and seeing what comes from that. Sometimes it is completely on the day, but at the moment a lot of my songs are very concept heavy, which almost always comes before the actual instrumentation.”
Do you help with the instrumentation when it comes to writing your music?
“I am not the most confident instrument player, but I can play guitar and piano well enough to write with. I usually take this to other instrumentalists and producers. I can’t produce but I am quite decisive and involved in the sound that is produced. I like to be kept up to date in the writing process”
It’s quite a common idea that the lead singer doesn’t do anything in the band such as write the music or help with load in etc, but it sounds like you are breaking that stereotype!
“To be honest I don’t help set up. I also never know where any of my kit is! So in that respect maybe I am the stereotype. I have in-ears for when I’m performing and I actually have no idea where they are. Jonny is the one who keeps everything organised. He has been the manager for this tour and he’s done a wonderful job keeping us all in order and knowing where everything is.”
Not the in ears though.
Phoebe: “I actually texted him last night saying I didn’t know where they were and he was like yeah I have packed them.”
(Jonny walks in)
Phoebe: “We have just been talking about how great of a tour manager you are!”
Jonny: “Oh god.”
All good things we promise!
How would you sell your music to someone that has never listened to you before?
Phoebe: “Oh my god this is a hard one! I would say it’s sad music you can move to. Happy sad songs.”
So it seems upbeat instrumentally until you tune into the lyrics and realise ‘Woah, this is actually kind of devastating’.
“Exactly that. Crushing souls while they can’t help but dance. And they are really gay”
You should put that on a T-shirt there’s a serious gap in the market for that I swear.
Tour life
What music has been getting you through the tour?
Phoebe: “Chapell Roan, lots of Charli XCX. We actually walk on to ‘Von Dutch’ so be ready for that one. What else?”
Jonny: “Quite a lot of Katy Perry.”
Phoebe: “So true. I texted my sister the other day and said ‘Teenage Dream might be the best song ever written.’ and she said she wasn’t sure about this. I reassured her, ‘No no, it is the best piece of music ever written’. I wasn’t willing to debate this topic. Lots of that, anything to keep Jonny awake on the long night drives.”
How have tensions been on tour? Has everyone got along?
“It has been really positive to be honest! Me and Jonny have been best mates for about four years now and then we have Tom the drummer who we have both known really well for about a year now and then Katie who is travelling with us doing some videography stuff. Everyone is just so lovely though so it’s been a dream. I would say I’m the least chilled out of everyone.”
That’s why you have to surround yourself with chilled people to balance everything out.
Exactly! Things have been going really well and I am excited to keep on going.”
I can’t wait to see your set! It has been a pleasure talking to you both.
Thanks so much for taking the time to talk to us!”
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After watching Phoebe Hall’s set, I was really taken aback by how connected I felt to the music as a queer artist. It was refreshing to hear her speak about these things in the light she was. This was a gig to remember and certainly something I will take with me for a long time. I am really excited to see where this trio takes their sound and themes as time goes on. I was also really inspired and excited by the undeniable energy created just by the band walking on. This is a group of people who feel incredibly connected to the music that this band makes, which is exactly what Phoebe was saying is so important for queer pop as it continues blossoming as a genre. Listen to Phoebe Hall on Spotify, Soundcloud, Apple Music, or any music streaming site.
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Photographer: Eliza Waite
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